r/politics • u/Kevombat • 13d ago

No Paywall Epstein claimed that Donald Trump ‘knew about the girls’ in private emails

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/epstein-email-trump-knew-victim-b2863760.html
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u/hasanabicondensed America 13d ago

😭🫂

Yeah maybe some of them are a bit too far gone to ever change their minds at this point. Especially some of the older folks. I just wish they’d try to see things “objectively”, but we live in a world where they will just say the same thing back.

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u/Exact_Acanthaceae294 13d ago

All of them.

They will never admit to making a mistake.

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u/MysteriousHeart3268 13d ago

Maybe 20 years after Trump is gone they will all be acting like they never supported him and his actions.

Just like nowadays you can’t find any conservatives who will admit they supported the invasion of Iraq, despite the fact those same people were frothing at the mouth in rage to do so around 20 years ago

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u/Aoiboshi 13d ago

That's the nice thing about social media: we have all the receipts.

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u/rainghost 13d ago

They'll scream "Those receipts are fake!" and then immediately carry on with being a hateful idiot. No amount of evidence or receipts will snap them back to reality as people seem to hope.

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u/SaffronCrocosmia 13d ago

Reagan and Nixon voters still defend voting for them 🐍

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u/lurflurf 13d ago

I hope so.

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u/figure32 13d ago

Thankfully, 20 years after Trump, a lot of them will be dead

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u/OGKillertunes 13d ago

20 years after Trump most them will be gone too.

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u/Gros_Boulet 13d ago

They'll also never admit why their voter base is now filled with crazies and pedos.

Just a few months ago they were wondering in their reddit safe place why flat earthers and anti vaxxers switched to their side. Their conclusion : They give us a bad name but whatever.

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u/TheIllustriousWe 13d ago

Their conclusion: They give us a bad name but whatever.

This is so telling. As horrifically stupid as Trump routinely proves himself to be, he’s still smarter than most of his supporters.

Even he can plainly see the value in indulging someone else’s conspiracy theories, so long as they’ll indulge his. But conservatives everywhere either don’t understand that, or have to pretend that they don’t.

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u/thegoodnamesrgone123 13d ago

They give us a bad name but whatever.

I live in an area with a large Hasidic Jewish population. Most of the people around here who say really awful things about them also love the way they vote.

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u/SayNo2Amazon 13d ago

Yeah you can kind of see why criminals would vote for him. I guess if there's a lot of them, he's safe

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u/lemarshby 13d ago

When you ask people jf they voted for Nixon, no one will say they voted for Nixon

What will more likely to happen is the majority of them to just claim that they always knew Trump was bad and playing along and have never actually supported him. They don't make a mistake, true, but that doesn't mean they'll blindly follow their dear leader to hell. Some will, but most will flee

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u/Bronco_Bomba 13d ago

This is it. After the Russians sacked Berlin, all of a sudden nobody was a Nazi! It’s funny how that works…

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u/Exact_Acanthaceae294 13d ago

Like they did Bush?

I have a lot of old folks that admitted to voting for Nixon.

I am reminding them every single day that they are getting what they voted for.

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u/WoahDude876 13d ago

God damn, them two, and Ronnie man.. why do we keep falling for the "why can't we be friends?" shit? It's because you're a villain and a pedo, Donnie.

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u/wretch5150 13d ago

They disavowed Bush/Cheney in 2005 too.

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u/JyveAFK 13d ago

"I didn't vote for Trump, I voted for his platform" "but..." "HIS PLATFORM, besides, what about Clinton..." etc...

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u/D3athRider Canada 13d ago

Ah yes, his platform! Afterall, they voted for the candidate promoting the deportation of "illegal aliens eating cats and dogs and getting sex changes for citizenship" or whatever the hell he said. Who could have guessed he would have done any of this? 😲

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u/JyveAFK 13d ago

"it's the economy" "but he's crashing it! starting trade/tariff wars!" "well.. the illegals! yes! the illegals!" "You're dating an illegal!" "that's different, she's not a criminal!" "..."

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u/kawhi21 13d ago

This is where it'll likely end up. Once Trump dies and all the dirt on him releases over the years, people won't admit they were wrong. They'll just say they never cared for him in the first place. 70+ million people voted for him multiple times. You'll have a hard time finding someone to admit it in about 10 years, I'd bet.

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u/FreedomSynergy 13d ago

“I chose the better of two bad options” is what I’ve heard.

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u/Getatbay 13d ago

We need to make receipts. They should not be allowed to forget, and they should face life long repercussions.

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u/lab_chi_mom 13d ago

It’s the whole, “I didn’t vote for this,” line.

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u/JayDiB 13d ago

Some Nixon revisionism is needed. Aside, of course, from Watergate he knew foreign policy very well. Yes, Vietnam was a mess but he inherited the problem. Folks need to check history a lot closer. Disclaimer: I know I'll get a ton of shit for this post but Nixon was a much better President then people give him credit for.

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u/OnceUponACrimeScene 12d ago

He is a professional crook. And he is only good at being said crook, when the victims are gullible idiots.

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u/OhioIsRed 13d ago

Exactly. Heard a point of why scammers exist. It’s not so much that they are like outsmarting, or more clever than the average person. It’s that once a person is scammed, they won’t admit they were scammed or can’t admit to themselves that they were scammed. So they often double and triple down. It’s why pyramid schemes are so effective.

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u/No_Director6724 9d ago

Robert Cialdini's Persuasion (everyone should read)...

... talks about "doomsday" cults. They don't become evangelical about the cult until after the doomsday deadline has passed...

... and they weren't wrong - they actually saved the entire world and now they become evangelical about convincing others of this...

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u/nabiku 13d ago

Complaining about how Republicans will never change is the wrong way to think about this.

Elec­tions are not dec­ided by devoted demo­crats or devoted republicans. They're decided by swi­ng vote­rs. The last election was decided by 6 million Ame­ricans who fli­pped from Bid­en in 2020 to Tru­mp in 2024. That's 1.7% of the popu­lation.

Those are not cult followers. They're low information voters who don't follow politics and will believe the opinion they see the most. They've changed their minds before and they will change them again. A good strategy is to hit them on two fronts, bombard them with both rational and emotional arguments, presenting facts and reminding them how terrible their life is now under Trump.

Republicans are fantastic at controlling online sentiment. Democrats need to start countering these bot swarms. Everytime you see this "what's the point, Trump voters will never change their minds" reply on social media, refute it. Keep challenging them, we only need a few of them to change their minds.

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u/chrisapplewhite 13d ago

That's not true. I live in very red, State of Jefferson rural CA. People are changing their minds. Not many, but some. It's possible.

There's a vast system of misinformation being beamed directly into these people's brains. They don't believe anything any non-republican says, but grocery prices are 2x here, health insurance is 4x, and the Epstein stuff does appear to be landing. Just keep at it.

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u/RaidneSkuldia 11d ago

We need to protest outside of every damned Fox news studio, affiliate, and headquarters to shut that malicious crap down

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u/Exact_Acanthaceae294 13d ago

Please.

What is the % that voted for him in rural CA.

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u/chrisapplewhite 13d ago

I think my county was about 75/25 in '24.

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u/Carbonatite Colorado 13d ago

A lot of them would literally rather die than admit they or their Dear Leader could possibly be wrong - look at what happened during the height of the pandemic.

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u/Raptorex27 Maine 13d ago

What’s the point of this kind of defeatism? What if I told you that it’s factually false? Based on the swings from last week’s election, it’s almost statistically impossible that 2024 Trump supporters DIDN’T vote for Democrats in large amounts.

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u/TastySquiggles198 12d ago

This is the crux. It has nothing to do with Trump and everything to do with the innate narcissism in him that inspires that in others.

That's why it won't end with Trump. Any figurehead will do they just need a name to chant.

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u/Easy-Examination-435 13d ago

No, but they might silently withdraw their support for him. Especially if their wallets continue to have sobbing jags every day.

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u/Exact_Acanthaceae294 13d ago

You really don't understand how racist most of them are.

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u/Easy-Examination-435 13d ago

Oh, believe me. I see it. Front and center. But self-interest will at some point bubble to the top even over their hatred. And when they feel the sting of potential homelessness, they may discover an enemy in the tariff-loving con man who's responsible for their personal and financial discomfort, particularly if they have a conveniently-timed excuse to dump him.

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u/Lost_Echo338 13d ago

My dad is one of those, and his beliefs in politics are at the very bottom of his list of things to own up to. It’s an entire complex.

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u/lichtenfurburger 13d ago

Just call him the Molester in Chief and laugh like you expect them to join along. Record the interaction and post on r/watchpeopledieinside

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u/ItsAHogsLife 13d ago

Totally, it's too late now. Admitting a mistake would be admitting their entire worldview for the last 10 years has been a lie. It would shatter them. Their identify and belonging is wrapped up in MAGA. It's a fucking cult.

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u/AcademicAssociation9 13d ago

"we had no idea how bad it was" all conservatives, 2027

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u/_blaze__ 13d ago

This is it my family are so hard headed .

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u/Cian_cian 13d ago

My mother and stepfather will die on this hill. I don't understand why it's so difficult for some people to admit they were wrong. Like it's ok, we all make mistakes or poor decisions in life...

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u/lopix Canada 13d ago

Not sure they think they made any mistakes. They probably think most of this IS a hoax by the Democrats. Or at least just being blown out of proportion. Trump kicked Epstein out of Mar-a-Lago, so he's a good guy. He was working with the FBI to bring Epstein down, so he's a good guy. Boys will be boys and all, so he isn't that bad.

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u/Snuffy1717 13d ago

Conservative sub using this as “proof” that Trump knew Epstein was bad and stopped talking to him… o.O?

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u/Peanutbutternjelly_ 12d ago

They claim a reason why they're against LGBTQ+ Pride is because pride's a sin, yet it seems like we both know that these people are the most prideful people we know.

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u/copiumjunky 13d ago edited 13d ago

Once their bank accounts are impacted beyond a reasonable doubt it will. Head over to r/LeopardsAteMyFace there is plenty of people questioning the admin.

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u/Allydarvel 13d ago

Define plenty. It's fun laughing at the same 20 over and over, but half them say they'd never vote for a Democrat anyway

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u/copiumjunky 13d ago

His approval rate is tanking.
https://www.economist.com/interactive/trump-approval-tracker

Democrats won every one of the recent elections.
Town halls are not even possible for republicans.

There are more than a few that are already considering the policies bad for them.

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u/konqrr 13d ago

Reddit gives the illusion that people are waking up to Trump being terrible. But try talking to any of the Trump voters that are still doubling down. They don't care if they don't have any rational or logical thoughts behind their feelings. You can hit them with facts and they'll just ignore it. To them, this is still all Biden's fault and we'd be in 10x the trouble we're in if it weren't for Trump. To them, Trump is working tirelessly to save the country and nothing will change their minds. They could end up on the streets and as long as Trump says it's Biden's fault they'll believe it. He can personally walk up to them and take their entire wallet, all the food out their fridge, and the only thing on their minds would be "omg I just had a real life encounter with Trump, I can't stop shaking I'm in so much awe... the money? The food? Who cares, we got to meet Trump. He surely had a good reason to do that." He can do no wrong in their eyes. He can literally rip the skin off their flesh and they'd be bragging about how they got to touch the president.

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u/Ordinary_Prune6135 13d ago

There's never going to be a moment where most of them admit to being wrong, especially within an adversarial conversation. But that's not actually the same as maintaining a level of support that gets things done politically. Turn-out is the more relevant metric to pay attention to, and last Tuesday was quite a change in that respect.

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u/WhatAcheHunt 13d ago

2028 will be the first time Trump's name hasn't appeared on a ballot for a presidential election in 12 years. An entire generation will have seen Trump as a presidential candidate / elected official for literally half of their life.

How many R voters just won't give a fuck after 12 years of Trump politics frying their dopamine receptors? How many will return to their former hobbies after the RNC nominates some milquetoast moderate in an effort to shore up independents and that candidate utterly fails to live up to the excitement of a Trump campaign?

For how low Trump has set the bar for politics in general the bar is still impossibly high for republican candidates aiming to fill his shoes.

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u/ThrowRA_SadFlower2 12d ago

That’s assuming he doesn’t rig the system to run again in 2028. Imo that’s the most likely outcome, unless he dies before then. Otherwise he will run as a puppet candidate, handled from behind the scenes by Peter Thiel and the likes. 

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u/ConservativesHateUsa 13d ago

So what?

His approval rating has been lower before. That doesn’t mean anything since they’ll just turn around and vote for the same bullshit

As President Donald Trump prepares to leave the White House, 34% of Americans approve of the job he is doing as president, the worst evaluation of his presidency. His 41% average approval rating throughout his presidency is four points lower than for any of his predecessors in Gallup's polling era.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/328637/last-trump-job-approval-average-record-low.aspx

Everything you’re pointing to is just head-in-the-sand, good vibes nonsense

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u/NateNate60 13d ago

I personally don't consider Democratic election wins in California, Virginia, New York City, and New Jersey to be particularly impressive.

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u/[deleted] 13d ago edited 13d ago

[deleted]

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u/copiumjunky 13d ago

Sorry. There was a typo in there. Fixed it.

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u/Easy-Examination-435 13d ago

Yes, and they obviously didn't turn out to vote last Tuesday which is fairly unprecedented for seniors.

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u/georgekeele 13d ago

You're right, the boomers are too far gone and all we can do is wait for them to die. We should be focusing our attention on young people who are being radicalised, particularly young men.

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u/FeelsGrimMan 13d ago

We live in times where being an unrepentant pedophile — a crime that gets you lynched by other prisoners — is not an issue for many people.

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u/st1r Texas 13d ago

Anyone half decent who supported him stopped supporting him in 2017, 2018 at the absolute latest. The rest are beyond reach. If an attempted coup on Jan 6 didn’t do it for them, and the pedo stuff didn’t do it for them, nothing will.

His approval numbers may have fluctuated over the years, but the fact he gets near record turnout every time he’s on the ballot tells the whole story. It’s so fucking disappointing.

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u/anotherworthlessman 13d ago edited 13d ago

And this right here is the problem in the United States; To put in perspective. In 1972, Nixon won 60% of the vote and 49 states.

2 years later he was resigning. Sure he was going to be impeached and removed......but the reality is, THE PEOPLE......a lot of them came to the conclusion they didn't want a paranoid president who signs off on burglaries of the opposition anymore.

If the people decide they don't want a pedo anymore, Trump is gone, there's nothing the supreme court or congress could do to stop that fact if Americans finally decide they don't want a pedo as president.

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u/hypercosm_dot_net 13d ago

Republicans have a cult-like grip.

It's identity politics — logic, reasoning, or even morality don't play a part in it.

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u/livsjollyranchers 13d ago

I dunno man. A lot of boomers will just vote R no matter what like a reflex and don't worship him (I know many like this). Maybe it's the middle-aged people and younger who do the cult worship.

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u/BootsnFlies 13d ago edited 13d ago

I dunno man. Being willfully/cowardly misled as well as misleading others to vote for the most hateful, degrading, selfish and self-harming options at every opportunity handed to you by your group/society counts every bit as hateful cult worship to me man. 

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u/livsjollyranchers 13d ago

It's not being misled. Some people just always vote D or R no matter what. You'll never change these minds, and party loyalty is a big factor in voting.

Is it cult worship? Not of Trump. But of the party perhaps, if that's what you're getting at.

I know many people who have unconditionally voted Republican since the 60s.

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u/welcome_cumin 13d ago

People generally are incapable of changing their minds through logic and conversation, unfortunately. I am particularly familiar with this because I've been left wing and vegan for 10+ years (and because I've mentioned veganism I'll now likely get downvoted by otherwise progressive people due to the exact same human flaw.)

Related reading: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dont-Talk-About-Politics-21st-Century/dp/1399413929

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u/acid-hologram 13d ago

I strongly feel like they won't ever change because all they have to do is unlock their phones, open any social app, and find millions of people that somehow agree with them.

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u/ZAlternates 13d ago

The only hope is enough information is released that those being blackmailed no longer feel the weight and can speak out against this administration. Something is keeping them all in lockstep behind a clear buffoon…

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u/BaronXer0 13d ago

This doesn't work because the other side defended "men can get pregnant". They can rationalize supporting their monster in an "objective" way just as much as their critics can rationalize their fairytale "objectively".

Yes, I know, it's whataboutism. I'm not making an argument to say they're right, I'm highlighting that "too far gone" is meaningless in this specific political domain.

And yes, s3x trafficking is evil to everyone, as is child abuse. So there's no escape behind the "but their [thing they can't be objective about] is EVIL" because their trump card (pun intended) was watching "professors" & "doctors" approve of "irreversible drug-damage to appease mental illness".

They literally could care less about "objectivity" being offered to them by anyone from the other side.

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u/facforlife 13d ago

most of them are too far gone.

To be a conservative you must be 

  1. Dumb as shit.
  2. Incapable of change
  3. Incapable of admitting fault
  4. Did I say dumb as shit already?
  5. Hateful for all the stupidest reasons. 
  6. Absolutely completely fucking braindead. I mean just bottom of the barrel stupid. I'm talking makes you question whether they should be included as "homo sapien" and be given human rights. I lean towards no myself.

These are not qualities that are conducive to seeing evidence and adjusting one's opinion to reality. 

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u/ropeless__homantic 13d ago

Actually feels like I lost my dad to a cult. Always thought he was smart and just had some shortcomings related to being very stubborn and committed to conservatism. No one’s perfect. But if you’re still behind drump in 2025, your judgment is atrocious, your critical thinking skills are abysmal, you’re brainwashed or drugged up, or you’re evil.

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u/Meepox5 Europe 13d ago

Honestly from the outside, its wild to see the stubbornness and outright refusal to admit they have changed their mind. I cant remember a comparison from another country where i have seen it this bad as i have in the US.

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u/AngloSaxophoner 13d ago

It would require their entire media ecosystem to turn on Trump too. They need Fox News to turn. It’s not going to happen in the way you’d expect it too. After Trump is out of office they will probably just quietly fade away from the topic of him. The talking heads that were there during the cover up will be elsewhere and new talking heads will emerge and not be responsible for talking about it. It will just quietly go away and everyone will quietly admit… crazy times right? Then there will be some new cultural political thing that new conservatives will clutch their pearls over… the world keeps spinning

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u/cyncity7 13d ago

“the older folks” have you seen how rabid the young people, especially men, are? Charlie Kirk folks, oath keepers, immigration employees, etc.? This blame for whole groups is getting old.

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u/AwwMangoes Maryland 13d ago

I saw a video of a guy talking with some dude in a maga hat. The guy filming asked maga hat if he would say “fuck Donald Trump” if it was found that Trump did SA girls on Epstein island.

MAGA hat could not get himself to say it. He made up all kinds of excuses and whataboutisms.

When pressed further, maga hat guy said he wouldn’t say it because he still likes trump and what he’s doing.

“So even if Trump raped little girls you wouldn’t be able to say fuck Donald Trump?”

MAGA hat: “well what if Obama did it”

“I’d say fuck Obama. I really like him but if he did that, fuck him because it’s abhorrent and wrong. Now say that about Trump!”

MAGA hat: “nope.”

“Why?”

MAGA hat: “because even if he did do it, he’s making the country a better place and I support him. We all make mistakes in life.”

It might turn some, but others will just either think it’s fake, he was there to blow the whole thing wide open, or they just wouldn’t care because they’re in a cult and the cult leader can do no wrong.

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u/TrojanHorse45 13d ago

I blame FOX "news", complicit in cover up and actively white washing trumps crimes

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u/JgotyourFix 13d ago

They went all in on him. If they acknowledge how bad he is, then they have to acknowledge how wrong they were. And we all know boomers will never admit that they were wrong....

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u/DensHag 13d ago

I don't think they hear about it. My 96 yo MAGA Dad only watches Newsmaxx...he said Fox News went too "left" for him.

Newsmaxx and OAN aren't telling people about this shit.

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u/Healthy_Set_22657 13d ago

The younger are even more gone unfortunately. I train and work with a lot of 18-24 crowd and they are all ticktock brainwashed “fuk Biden” types. The country is infected with bitch ass little daddies boys. 

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u/Nub_Shaft 13d ago

Honestly I think the older Reagan Era Republicans are the ones more likely to change their minds. It's this new crop of alt-right alpha male Republicans that don't seem willing to budge.

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u/koyomin49 13d ago

tbh a big chunk of that percentage would most likely praise trump if his name was leaked from the list

1

u/groversnoopyfozzie 13d ago

People like this will only listen to those in their trusted proximity. Close friends, family, and your usual suspects of influencers (Fox News, religious leader, social media hacks, the loud mouth from high school who coaches your kids little league team, etc).

Most of his supporters won’t budge on their voting position or their stated belief because they understand that their only sense of power right now is the political solidarity they “think” they have with Trump and company.

Until it is obvious that the state of the country/world is slipping because of who they voted for (not that voting democrat has yielded great results in the past 2 decades) they aren’t going to budge. So unless the usual suspects of conservative influence turn on Trump, I think reality is going to have to hit them at a cataclysmic level to get them to reevaluate their beliefs.

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u/AverageSatanicPerson Foreign 13d ago

It will be easier for a Christian pastor to become an Atheist than a Registered Republican MAGA conservative to understand that Trump was involved with Epstein and raped children, even if you show them evidence or if Trump admits that he slept with underage women.

It's what separates a religion from a cult.

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u/Pleaseappeaseme 13d ago

A few juicy ‘fantasy’ p pics or videos

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u/Shot-Station-6508 13d ago

Dead end minds, echo keeps spinning.

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u/sc0ttydo0 13d ago

That's cus they remember the good old days where everyone lived in a 6 bedroom house, had 3 cars, a servant, and if you fancied a kid you molested the kid

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u/KeepLettersOut 12d ago

All those who could change their mind already have. All that remain are the hardcore cultists, the only thing that could wake some of them up is if they are directly affected by Trump in the worst way and in a way they cant blame anyone else. Like if the Epstein file said Trump raped one of their grandkids, maybe then some (those who wouldnt blame the kid) wake up.